Adam Lovick (00:00):

My grandmother fired me. She didn’t see a need for the marketing guy anymore. During Covid, when I was let go, I started what is now first class jerk, and today it’s a media publishing company based here in New York,

Ross Borden (00:09):

Fired by grandma. That’s awesome. Your style has always been green screen.

Adam Lovick (00:15):

Green screen. To me it was more of a lower lift way to tell a story. It’s not just travel influencers. You’re up against every influencer because everyone wants to travel.

Ross Borden (00:24):

This is creator, the podcast from Matador Network. I’m your host Ross Borden, and I believe creators are the future of all global advertising. So join me as I sit down with top creators to hear about how they got started, the challenges they’ve overcome, and the tips you need to become a full-time creator. We are back. Welcome to another episode of Creator the podcast. We are here today with Adam Lovick, travel creator. You probably know this guy from TikTok. He also has Instagram. He’s also the creator of his own brand, first class jerk, which I want to hear all about. Adam, thanks for joining. Where are you joining us from today? How are you,

Adam Lovick (01:08):

Ross? Thanks for having me. I am based in New York, so that’s where I’m joining from and everything is well, I’m excited to be here.

Ross Borden (01:17):

Thanks for joining. So Adam, tell me and the audience a little bit about yourself and just sort of how it all began.

Adam Lovick (01:26):

Yeah, I think from a travel perspective, travel was kind of always in the family. My parents, my grandmother started a business in 1984. I’m originally from Minnesota, and so travel was kind of always a part of the family. We’d always go on trips, whether it was my grandmother bringing us or my dad and mom. So always been really fortunate to travel to a variety of places. So that’s kind of where I kind of found an early passion for travel. Like I said, I’m from Minnesota. I played hockey growing up my entire life, so travel opportunities were somewhat limited. I played leading up to college, I played Division one hockey, but throughout that time I always had an interest in being in the family business. And so whether it was painting office walls or helping out the marketing and social media programs, I was in some capacity involved.

(02:22):

And it was probably mostly because I knew the perks and the perks were going on trips. And so at an early age, it was in the blood post-graduation in college. This was 20 18, 20 18, 20 19. I just saw the opportunity in content. I always had an interest in it. I’d carry around a Canon camera, take a lot of photos and videos and bring those tools with me on these trips. And at that point I was publishing a lot of social content and this was kind of the start of TikTok and was bringing some of that content to that platform and was fortunate enough to build a small community there to share sharing my passion for travel. And later 2020, at that point, and I’m kind of speeding ahead here, I’d worked with a company post-graduation hit, and I was actually fired from my grandma’s is how the story goes.

(03:20):

My grandmother fired me. She didn’t see a need for the marketing guy anymore during Covid, and that was a rough time for everyone in the industry and even beyond it. But when I was let go, I started what is now first class jerk, and at the time it was just a fun project and today it’s a media publishing company based here in New York. And so that’s kind of the origin story. Parallel my career in travel, I was kind of paralleling a content career, if you will, and have been fortunate to have a variety of opportunities with brands and building a community both on Instagram and TikTok. So yeah, that’s kind of landed me here, I guess,

Ross Borden (04:01):

Fired by grandma. That’s awesome. So you’re fired by your grandma, but you’re seeing at the same time something’s going on with content. There’s an opportunity to turn kind your passion for travel into something as a formal career. I discovered you personally on TikTok and I was like, this guy is great. He’s got a great voice. He goes deep into detail about all these hotels that I’ve always wanted to visit. So I’m learning while I’m watching. I always feel like travel creators, they take different styles, and your style has always been green screen style or tell me if that’s wrong, but a lot of the videos, especially that I first saw and discover you were like in depth one or two minute green screen videos where you dive deeply into a specific destination or an incredible hotel. Tell us about why you went with that and why you think it sort of struck a chord with an audience.

Adam Lovick (05:01):

Yeah. Well, I think first and foremost, that format started during covid, and so access to travel was a little limited. So I think TikTok evolved quite a bit in the last four years. And I might even be getting my timeframes, my timeline wrong here because I’m not sure when that feature rolled out, but I thought green screen to me whenever it started, it was more of a lower lift way to tell a story. And while a lot of research goes into this stuff, well, I have had some personal experience with some of these properties or airlines that we’ve talked about via green screen. It was just a way to share content at scale without actually having to be there. And so that was kind of a format that we thought would be a low lift way to tell a story, and you can still convey it with some of the assets are readily available online. So that was kind of our original approach. Now, I think a lot of that has evolved in some degree, boots on the ground, brings a little validity to the content and bringing people with you as if they’re there is a great approach, but everyone has a different style. And I think, yeah, I’ve kind of pigeonholed myself into the green screen guy, I guess.

Ross Borden (06:20):

And the content, the photos or the videos that you’re using behind you for the green screen, are you just grabbing those off the Instagram account of that destination or that hotel or that crew, or where are you getting the content that you’re speaking about?

Adam Lovick (06:36):

Yeah, it’s a great question because the internet can be the wild West, and we’ve obviously at an early stage we rented some issues by grabbing photos that weren’t owned by the properties and they were creators that shot this photo or shot this video, and it just happened to be on the properties page. And so we’ve run into those issues and we’ve tried to get better and better about if we are using a creator’s video or a creator’s photo that we’re asking for permission. But it’s hard to really track down to be totally honest with you. And so a good process for us has been going to the actual property or airlines page because it’s safe to assume that it’s their right or it’s their property unless that photo has been tagged with the photographer’s handle.

Ross Borden (07:21):

Totally, yeah, it makes sense.

Adam Lovick (07:23):

Yeah.

Ross Borden (07:24):

So TikTok, you have what, almost 300,000 followers now. You are much smaller, but you still have a very engaged following on Instagram. Tell us about the differences between those two platforms. If someone’s starting out as a creator, would you encourage them to start on TikTok or equal parts both, or where are you putting most of your focus?

Adam Lovick (07:47):

Yeah, it’s a good question. I think syndication, which I guess maybe in simpler terms, creating for one platform and distributing across multiple has become kind of a normal exercise for folks. I have been putting most of my time and energy into TikTok because I think the separation of an Instagram page and an Instagram audience and a TikTok audience, I mean they were built with different, I think the audience there just personally are a little bit different. So I think the TikTok a lot has changed. Ross a lot has changed and it’s hard to keep up with, but I think from a TikTok perspective, the organic reach was just naturally stronger than Instagram. But when Instagram started incorporating reels, I think that algorithm has become a little healthier in terms of organic reach. Same with YouTube shorts, but what I’ve put a lot of time in on an Instagram front is building first class jerk, and then what a lot of time I’ve been building on TikTok is my personal brand. And you know what? I don’t think I’m a great case study for that, to be honest, because I go a little bit back and forth on what the best approach is. I think where I guess my methodology or the method to the madness is make really good content. If it performs on TikTok, it might be a signal that it can perform on Instagram.

Ross Borden (09:11):

Yeah. So tell us about first Class Jerk, because when I mentioned you’re smaller on Instagram, that’s your personal Instagram account, but you guys have hundreds of thousands of followers on first Class Jerk on Instagram. So start from the beginning. What made you start jump from just being a creator and a brand around your own name to a brand and now as you said, a publishing company? And then I want to hear all about the company, where you guys are at, what you’re doing, how it’s

Adam Lovick (09:40):

Working. Yeah, totally. For Start, I think, well, we have never publicly shared where the name first class year comes from, but we’ve had a lot of comments around that name and if it’s appropriate, I think in some contexts it might not be, but I think we want it to be a little different and a little bit more irreverent, if you will. And I think people take travel a little too seriously at times. And so this was kind of a way to be different, but first Class Jerk, as I mentioned, started as a way to have a voice in the industry during Covid. And I had worked in the industry for four or five years prior to it launching, but it was always a side project. And over the last year, we’ve really gotten serious about being a leading voice. I think the mission has always been how can we tell better stories around travel for the internet? I think that’s the mission. And I think in a lot of ways travel has been one of the industries that hasn’t really been disrupted from a media publishing standpoint outside of what a traditional influencer looks like. But when we think about some of the legacy players like Travel and Leisure, Conde Nast, Conde Nast, I was get in trouble for that one. We wanted to have an opinion. And when people think of opinion and media and publishing, they might think of a platform or a brand like Barstool.

(11:05):

They started out as talking about sports and they’ve obviously expanded into a number of different sectors.

Ross Borden (11:11):

One of the few successful stories of any digital media company in the last 20 years, one that’s actually reached mega scale, unlike Buzzfeed or Vice that have been total disasters, barstools kind of alone in the category.

Adam Lovick (11:26):

Totally. And I don’t think we’ve ever taken it from a position of how can we replicate Barstool, but I think there’s a lot of good takeaways and some of those takeaways are being personable, being humid and having an opinion, having a take. And I think a lot of people were scared to do that in travel. I don’t typically like to share why we’re better than other folks or other people in this business, but I do think we have a stronger pulse when it comes to social. I think the way we’re utilizing social and content strategy is stronger than some of the other legacy players. We’ve always taken a social first approach to telling stories for the internet, and we also have a newsletter which we reference as a blog. I think Russ this better than anybody, but your site is healthy with a lot of articles. And we just knew we never wanted to, we weren’t going to get to a point where we were publishing daily, frequently daily. And so we wanted to be a little bit more thoughtful on what we were releasing in terms of written word. And so we brought gathered 30,000 subscribers on Substack, and that’s where that content lives. That’s our build out right now. We are a social brand, we’re a travel brand with a social presence and a newsletter.

Ross Borden (12:48):

Let’s talk about brands and monetizing now because congrats. I mean, it’s harder than most people think to build 30,000 subscribers to a newsletter and really put out high quality content. I think you’re twice a month, is that right?

Adam Lovick (13:02):

Yeah, it’s about twice a three times a month. This is a pretty early venture for us, but yeah, somewhere around there at this moment.

Ross Borden (13:07):

So when a brand comes to you and they say, Adam, we love your videos, we love your content, we saw you on TikTok, we want to work with you, and we’ll get into some specific brands that you’ve worked with recently, but when that happens, what do you do? Do you just say, Hey, yep, let’s do a partnership with Adam Lubbock, or do you say, Hey, have you seen first Class Jerk, we could offer you all these other services and try and build it into more of a proper media campaign rather than just a creator program?

Adam Lovick (13:35):

Yeah, that’s a great question, Ross. I don’t have a straight answer for you at this moment because that’s definitely something we’ve been evaluating because there are two things. They’re two different entities, but they’re very much binary. For maybe few people that know me know that I have this brand, but when it comes to clients and they’re reaching out to Adam Lubbock, the question is always what was the reason for the initial reach out? And we’ve had both answers. We’ve said, we want to work with Adam Lubbock the talker, or we want to work with the brand first class jerk and positioning. That has been a new exercise for us. I think the idea of course is it’d be great to do a partnership with Adam, but my goal at the end of the day is to bring people into the first class jerk world of things.

(14:24):

Again, I think those things are binary. So in terms of packages or a full media campaign, I’m very much involved in that because it’s an audience that is very similar to what we built on first class jerk. So it’s just amplifying, which is very similar to what I think is the Barto model. They have talent and they’re talent heavy talent forward. We have a brand and that brand founder, if you will, is also a travel content creator. And so I think it’s project to project basis, but at the end of the day, I really want to create a brand, and I know creating a relationship with folks as Adam Lubbock is important doing that.

Ross Borden (15:07):

And what does a package look like when a brand comes to you and they’re like, we want to go all in. We love first class jerk. We want to be on Adam’s channels. What do you guys put together for them? Is it written content and video? Is it something else

Adam Lovick (15:22):

We’ve thrown the ship at? This is everything that is included in what is the first class jerk network, and we’ve broken down that audience as veteran travelers, 25 to 44 that appreciate premium experiences. So I think there’s a lot of people, a lot of folks that find that audience valuable. So as a distribution channel, we’ve been approaching conversations mostly as a distribution channel and content creation channel. So we create content and we distribute it across our channels. That is typically how partnerships work for us.

Ross Borden (15:54):

So let’s talk about brands. Now. I’ve seen you work with Delta, I saw a recent program, you went to the US Open with Emirates that looked like an exciting partnership. How are you finding these are some of the biggest brands in travel? Are they all approaching you? Are you guys doing outreach, you and your business partner to partner with big brands like that? Where did you get started in this sort of like, okay, this is actually making money now or producing revenue, and how did you get there?

Adam Lovick (16:25):

Yeah, I mean, Adam Lubbock as a creator, as an influencer, I started getting brand deals prior to first class jerk even really being a serious business. And so as you mentioned Delta, that’s been a long-term partnership over the last few years. But my first brand deal was a luggage company. I think it was Traveler’s Choice, if I’m not mistaken. And once, it was kind of an interesting thing because it was maybe three years ago, and those partnerships and those conversations have definitely evolved over that time. But I feel like what ends up happening in the world of influencer is once you do one, do two, these other brands see you as someone that can be a potential advocate for their brand. I think everyone kind of gets thrown off at like, oh, I dislike putting ad on these things, but I think it’s validity. I think it shows that you’ve worked with brands, it shows that you’re serious, it shows that you’re about it.

(17:23):

And so after that first one, there are obviously more that came that followed, but I’m very self-aware in the sense that my channel is much smaller than some of these other creators, and there’s always going to be bigger creators. And so a lot of these things were me emailing people and emailing folks. I had identified people that I wanted to work with and I had out to them and I gotten nitty gritty and emails and dms and kind of identified the folks that maybe are in a position to make decisions. And so at an early stage, I was cold emailing, and even today, Ross, this thing is very young. I’m somewhat of a smaller creator in the grand scheme of things. First class jerk is somewhat of a smaller page. If we look at the vanity metrics of followers, we’re still doing that. That still exists and I think it should, we get some inbound, but a lot of these conversations we’re having is we’re approaching these folks and identifying who makes decisions and taking a lot of Zoom calls.

(18:33):

So it’s evolved over time. There’s been small jobs, there’s been big jobs, but I think for us, we identified brands we want to work with and we started creating content about them, and it was kind of a proof of concept. It was a case study, Hey, listen, we think this is a good fit because here are some really good examples of our audience reacting positively. The thing that’s interesting about it, Ross, is as all of these, what we’ve run into is when it comes to hotels and airlines, every influencer and their mother wants to work with travel companies, I think it’s a great way to get access to then make content. These platforms are paying out creators a large amount to make good content. I think a lot of people realize, well, being on the road traveling to sexy hotels, being in first class is going to make for good content. And so that’s what you’re kind of up against. You’re up against these. It’s not just travel influencers. You’re up against every influencer because everyone wants to travel. And so I guess the reason I say that is you kind of have to get nitty gritty sometimes and you got to find a, what is your differentiating factor? So that’s just kind of a takeaway. If anything, after all these conversations we’ve had with brands and partnerships,

Ross Borden (19:47):

What about influencer agencies? I mean, there’s tons of them now, and I always have a laugh to myself, like we work with 900,000 influencers, and I’m like, you guys don’t actually know any of these people. Matador. We have our elite team of a thousand influencer slash creators who have huge follows that we bring to brands one by one. We all know them very well. We’ve worked with many of them, most of them, many of them multiple times. What’s your POV on influencer agencies,

Adam Lovick (20:22):

I guess influencer agencies we’ve been approached by, or at least I’ve been approached by, I get your question. I think for us it’s always beneficial to work with an agency that’s going to middleman these types of clients and projects. And ultimately these are the people, these are the folks that at least in our experience, are bringing your name forward to these brands. So that’s similar to Matador. Setting up influencers with brands that need content is a great service and it’s very appreciative because the one-on-one conversations you’re having with brands, they end up, it’s hard to get to the person that can make the decision, whereas a lot of these influencer agencies are handling campaigns and they need to bring in a group of influencers that make sense and you want to prove to them that you’re one of ’em. So we’ve had a lot of conversations, maybe less influencer agencies, more PR agencies, but influencer agencies in my experience have been great and very helpful, and building a relationship with them is incredibly important, and I think a lot of people overlook that.

Ross Borden (21:31):

We have as the Network and Matador Network is our network of creators, and we started offering a free service to D Os and Travel brands to fill those press trips, otherwise known as FAM trips, famils fam

Adam Lovick (21:46):

Trips,

Ross Borden (21:48):

And it’s amazing. We started doing that. We helped them connect with better and better creators and then they would come back and say, actually, we have a new project and this one has a budget. And so it’s been great because offering that free service has gotten us into a bunch of paid partnerships where we have a great budget to play with and do more influencer style programs.

Adam Lovick (22:11):

I think to that note, I think just in my experience, especially in the travel industry, brands more now than ever want to work with people that actually give a shit. I think it ends up being just kind of another project for most folks. As we know, influencing in general, being a content creator has become a very appealing job to most folks. But when it comes to brand partnerships, I think people want longevity. I think people want more programs they want to be a part of, want to be of these brands and their evolution for longer than one project. And so I just think that’s maybe how brands are thinking about future influencer strategy and ideally that’s how I think influencers can actually make a sustainable business model is how can you get folks for a long period of time, how can you be, for lack of

Ross Borden (23:10):

A better term, embed with these brands for an extended period of time? Because I think it just builds a stronger relationship, more like an ambassadorship rather than a flash in the pan campaign-based program.

Adam Lovick (23:21):

Exactly. Yeah.

Ross Borden (23:23):

It seems like that’s what you’ve done with Delta. You said you’ve been working with Delta for a long time. How did that happen? I actually saw, I think you were at South by Southwest with the Delta CEO. I saw a selfie with you and the CEO of Delta. So tell us about that relationship.

Adam Lovick (23:42):

Yeah, I was incredibly fortunate to work with Delta and be kind of in the family for the last few years. I’m from Minneapolis, that’s been a Delta hub for a long time. I obviously Delta very loyal flyer, so that was kind of a top brand for me that was kind of pie in the sky. And it came pretty early in my career of doing content. But they rolled out an ambassador program. They were kind of piloting an ambassador program because I think, and that was the reason I brought some of that up, is I think brands want to work with creators for a long extended period of time. And I was a part of that first year of an ambassador program. And so throughout the year they have a variety of initiatives, one being south by Southwest, opening up new lounges, events, announcements. And so they brought on, I think five creators for the first year to be a part of some of these bigger campaigns and blow them out. So I was very fortunate to work with them, world-class airline for sure. And so I’m very thankful and the ED thing is anytime I see him, because he tends to make an appearance at some of these events. Anytime I see him, I make sure I get a photo with him. Yeah, he seems like a cool guy.

(24:58):

Yeah, yeah, he’s a great guy. He makes a lot. Yeah, exactly, exactly. A CEO that’s forward facing and on the ground. Yeah, he’s a great guy. The reason we were there, they invited us out there, so they invited all the ambassadors out there to kind of showcase this event at South Bay. It was kind of the first time they had done something like that with the whole position of Delta is more an airline becoming a lifestyle brand, being able to bring the experience in the air to the ground. That was the whole messaging and they brought us all down there to showcase what that event was about.

Ross Borden (25:34):

One question I ask every creator is like, what was it like to make the leap? It sounds like you’re all in now between first class jerk and your current and your personal channels at Adam Lubbock on TikTok, especially in Instagram, what was the biggest grossing revenue month you’ve ever had? And tell me about that idea because working at a New York ad agency semi recently, and then you’re like, fuck it, I’m going all in and I’m going to be a full-time creator. Tell us about that decision, what that was like, and where you had to be financially as a creator to be able to make the leap.

Adam Lovick (26:15):

Yeah. Well, I was actually let go from my job at the agency. The brand I was working on was a small media publishing within Vayner and they terminated the brand. And so at that point, it kind of felt like a good opportunity for me to make the leap because at the time, as I mentioned, I was kind of paralleling these projects, and so it just felt timing wise, it was a good opportunity. I’m all in and I’ve given myself a little runway, but the reality is this stuff is really hard. People underestimate how much time and energy it takes to be a creator to, I mean Ross, you know this, to own a business and to build a business from the ground, it is a big leap and I’m proud of myself for doing it, but there’s a lot of work left to be done.

(27:03):

I think people underestimate, maybe, especially living in New York, how you need to set yourself up financially to sustain what is a startup at this point or a small business. But yeah, I think I made the leap. It felt right. We had some momentum with first class jerk. I don’t want to look back in 10 years and say I didn’t give it a shot, and I have a lot of conviction of what we’re building. I really do. I don’t think there’s anyone that is doing what we’re doing in this space in terms of telling stories for social, and I think we’re in a good spot with that. And so like I said, there’s a lot of work left to be done, but yeah, I think you mentioned what’s like the highest revenue. Yeah, I think we’ve had good months, we’ve had bad months, and that’s come the reality of being a creator.

(27:57):

And that’s why I always wanted to be in a position to have a brand. I think a brand excited me. I didn’t think running around with showcasing everything I do in my life was a sustainable thing for me. And I think people do. I mean, a lot of people do that and a lot of people love it. It just wasn’t necessarily for me, I want to be a part of first class jerk. I want the affiliation. I want people to make the connection, but I don’t necessarily want to be only an influencer, if you will. I want to have a brand. I want to have a service. I want to build something for lack of a better, maybe for a LaMer phrase, but something bigger than myself, and that continues to be the gold.

Ross Borden (28:44):

Yeah. So Adam, one other question that I ask everyone on the show, because we’ve talked a lot about being a creator and the business of being a creator a lot. We haven’t talked enough about travel, so I want to hear about some of your favorite places on earth. And I always ask people to travel a lot. If you had to decide on three countries to live in for the rest of your life and your passport was only good in those three countries, you cannot go anywhere other than those three countries. What would the three countries be and why?

Adam Lovick (29:17):

Yeah. Wow. That’s great, Ross. It’s like asking your favorite kid. No, I like the question, where could you live? Three countries? And I want to be diverse. I want to be thoughtful about this, but the first thing that comes to mind is the us. I think that’s an answer, right? That’s fair. I could say that.

Ross Borden (29:37):

Oh, yeah. Yeah. A lot of people go other than the us. No, including the us. If us is in the three, it’s got to be one of the three.

Adam Lovick (29:46):

I love the us. I mean so many people know this, but so many people also overlook it. There’s just so much going on here from the national parks to the beaches to the, I mean, there’s just so much happening. It is so incredibly diverse, so incredibly diverse. If I could only travel to one country in my entire life, I’d say in the US forever. But I think my other answer is Italy, or I’m kind of torn between Italy and Spain. I think Italy got to

Ross Borden (30:14):

Make decision. I need three. Need three.

Adam Lovick (30:17):

Yeah. Okay. I say the us I will say Italy, I love Italy. I love Italian people. I love Italian food, but I think Spain is also sneaky, and I haven’t spent a ton of time in Asia. I think another maybe obvious answer would be Japan, but I’m going to go us, Spain and Italy. I think what Spain offers is outside Italy obviously has the Dolomites and you can go north, but I think Spain is a very interesting country. I think Myorca got beat up a little bit over the last few years. I think maybe overran if you will, but incredible place. I think Barcelona is an amazing city, and I think I’ve always wanted to do the Camino. So I think I would have to say Spain, Italy, and us. And I feel like that’s kind of a lame answer, but I’m kind of a simple guy.

Ross Borden (31:08):

Awesome.

Adam Lovick (31:09):

Yeah.

Ross Borden (31:10):

Cool. Well, that’s just about it time. Thanks for joining. Anything else you want to share, and can you just review for those listening where people can follow and find you online?

Adam Lovick (31:21):

Yeah. At first class Jerk on Instagram, we have a newsletter at Adam Lubbock on any other platform that you use is where you can find us.

Ross Borden (31:28):

Awesome. Thanks for joining, Adam. Good luck out there and we’ll work with you soon.

Adam Lovick (31:33):

Russ, I appreciate you. Thank you for having me on.

Ross Borden (31:37):

Creator, the podcast is produced by Matador Network. We are a leading global travel publisher focused on travel and adventure. If you enjoyed today’s episode, please subscribe. Every week I interview a new top creator. New episodes are released every Tuesday on YouTube, apple Podcasts, Spotify, and everywhere podcasts are found. Thanks for listening.